This weekend i built a sixboard chest for members of the alabama. I am a hobbyist, so i rarely use more that a couple of tablespoons of glue when i work. Differences between titebond glues the wood whisperer. Most of us that use hhg hot hide glue use it because once it dries. I use a wax heater rather than a double boiler as it is a bit faster. If you are using a hot hide glue the kind you have to melt you may find it very smelly. The temperature will vary with the amount of urea added. Liquid hide glues do not smell very strong at all, so theyre easier to be around. Hide glue, especially if you mix your own and use a hot glue pot, is a different animal and takes a little getting used to. The prices for replacing look crazy so i thought i might try and glue it. Once dissolved, it can keep for a long time if refrigerated and sealed most recommend 3 days to a week, i managed to keep a larger. Hot hide glue is what musical instruments where built with for centuries, although synthetic adhesives have greatly reduced its use recently. I recon most of what i build wont be around in 100 years, not due to poor build, or the glue i use, but for the simple fact of people.
I agree with chris about using some titebond hide glue. But some luthiers seem to have good results with tb 1. I have a project im working on and i need to know what hot glue does not stick too. Hide glue is the oldest and most traditional of all the glues used in woodworking. This material not only works like hot hide glue but works better then hot hide glue.
Ancient hide glue techniques join modern woodworkingand practically everything else. Hot hide glue is only a headache if you havent got a suitable. Making using hide glue is just as easy as making it. I have been asked several times how properly prepare hide glue. There is a wealth of information about it on the web. Stick the brush back into the pot on the next round of glue up and the hot hide glue will reconstitute. Since i glue and clamp the clamp time is minimized to 10 seconds or so with the use of accelerator. Mark the desired grain direction on each piece of cardboard so you wont make a mistake. There are lots of myths around hide glue like it isnt very strong, wont last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, wont keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it there are more but ill start with these and you can question me about any others you may be worrying about. How to prepare hide glue for musical instrument repairs. Sometimes an oily wood can be glued with regular yellow glue with no. Our ground hide glue is high clarity and dries clear, making crack repairs invisible.
Hide glue is perfect for repairs because joints can be cleanly disassembled with heat, moisture, and a hot knife. According to the literature, the temperature should not exceed 145 or so, but thats presuming the glue will be heated all day in factory use, and reheated the next day. There are different strengths available and they all have different gelling times. By simply using hot hide glue, you can apply glue to a block of wood, known as a glue block, and hold it in place until the glue gels. Hot hide glue has the advantage of gelling quickly and holding glue blocks in place almost immediately. A rub joint, wherein you add glue to two pieces of wood and rub them together until the glue achieves its initial tack, is a benefit of hot hide glue. I have heard the guys from the institutes talk about the correctly made chair that wont need glue repairs. Tages hardbound book is entitled tage frid teaches woodworking shaping. Hide glue has fallen out of favor in the modern era, but ian kirby still finds a place for it in his shop. There was some discussion on the pe tech talk board about the best method to use for final trimming the veneer close to the box. So treat the surface like usauceonthebrain suggested or use the hot glue in such a manner that its shape will hold it in place for example on pieces where theres a hole in them, make sure there is glue on both sides of the hole. Sometimes it will stick solidly, and other times it will just ping off under any sort of force.
Most furniture over a hundred years old will most likely be held together with hide glue and that statistic means hundreds of millions of pieces. Like others have said when you assemble something like chairs that you know will need a repair down the road, its just not smart to ignore something like hide glue for its benefits. Chris is the former editor of popular woodworking magazine. Award winning instructor frank strazza of the heritage school of woodworking discusses the history of hide glue, goes over the pros and cons of using it, and demonstrates the proper way to prepare. Hot hide glue is superior, but its a bit more fiddly in terms of mixing it, having the glue pot, working time, etc. This is a subject that is sorely needed in the field of player piano rebuilding and every other form of furniture building. If you have another basic kind of question about hot animal hide glue that we havent covered, maybe i can add it to this list. In fact if it gets wet, the glue may reactivate and potentially let loose a joint. Discussion in the small company luthiers started by skydog, oct 4.
It is the only glue that wont cause a stain on your finish. The best source for glue granules at a reasonable price is from patrick edwards old brown glue site. Oldfashion hide glue is one of the oldest kinds of adhesives on the planet, but even in this age of snazzy hightech super glues it remains a highly useful, sometimes indispensable addition to the woodworkers arsenal of stickums. I have been working in a pair of lamp stands dunbar and decided to try my hand at using hot hide glue. Also, you can add urea to hot hide glue to extend its open time. How to remove hide glue finn mccuhil pin share tweet. Titebond wont hold very well onto something it cannot penetrate, such as glass. Hide glue smells only as bad as a wet rawhide chew toy. Is hot glue incredibly weak, or did i just buy bad quality. Hot hide glue not hide glue from a bottle or fish glue are favorites to deal with issues 1, 2, and 3. Because of this characteristic, you can reverse its bond with a heat and. The head split around the tuning pegs and i would like your opinion as to what the best glue to use.
When removing hide glue from antiques or instruments, apply hot water only to the areas necessary for glue removal. Hide glue highest quality 192 gram for musical instruments and fine furniture by musicaravan. I think regular liquid hide glue would also work well. With the glue on one surface, tradition says slide the board from left to right. It wont stick to the old hide glue in the joint anyway. Hot glue, like many other glues, wont stick to smooth nonporous surfaces. My reason for using hide glue the english woodworker. Hide glue in liquid form popular woodworking magazine. Beares charge double for dry hide glue, and tripple for liquid hide glue. Materials science and engineering at case western reserve. Facts about hot hide glue by craig brougher playercare. Coating both sides with pva wood glue will ruin the finish.
Yes hide glue is harder to work with in that you have to prepare it, clamp it before it cools, do the clean up of the squeeze out etc. Liquid hide glue is my first choice for all my woodwork followed closely by hot hide glue. The thing is extremely well made and will last generations. However, when youre working on a guitar that has had hide glue used, it is much easier to fix as the glue s cohesion is easily reversible with heat and moisture steam. No need for a veneer press with this product as it sticks on contact and it doesnt warp the veneer. My shop this time of year is around sixty five degrees. Hide glue is fairly stout stuff, and it can take a fair bit of abuse. Working with hot hide glue yamaha vintage fg acoustic. Glue blocks and veneering are both good examples of why hot hide glue should be used. I use a popsicle stick to stir it and when it is hot i add water until it just runs off the stick in a.
I have used contact adhesive the same i use for laminate for leather covered inset panels. As mentioned in my previous post when one also works in a direction so that the accelerator does not contaminate the fret board where the ca will be applied next one can glue and clamp all frets in a matter of minutes. And while most everyone agrees that you cannot get a true rub joint with liquid hide glue as you do with the hot hide glue, theres still a certain amount of tack available. I havent found anything better than this and in this case tradtion wins. Glue a piece for the bass bar, a strip of wood to the bar with epoxy and then glue the bar into the top with hide glue to the wood strip. I need your advice, i am using hide glue for the first time. It is easier to take apart, bonds to other glues, is very stable, you can apply it over itself or any other glue, and smells awful its made from boiled animal hide. Reverse hide glues bond popular woodworking magazine. The liquid hide glues are ready to use and do not require any special tools or treatment. Hide glue is the standard glue that is used by violin makers, and is prized for its organic nature and ability to be dissolved to remove a plate or other part of a violin and perform necessary repairs. It is in fact real hide glue and not fake hide glue. That allows one to find about a dozen lead weights of about 1 lb apiece or somewhat less and rotate them leapfrog through the entire range of pneumatics.
If youre going to use liquid hide glue, use old brown. It is so simple, that i am definitely going to make some myself, just as soon as i get home from this trip one of the other reasons that using hot hide glue is tough. Bone glue is used for hard bond joints where not much flexibility is needed, rabbit skin for things that might move a bit its more elastic. A few months ago i purchased the lee valley small hot hide glue pot. You can even buy various brands of 2 part silicone molding material and make your own shapes for squeezing the glue into or onto which wont.
Product title fpr dt2010 hot melt glue sticks, all temps, 10 in. Neither hot nor liquid hide glue have that problem, so gluing both faces works well if. Too much water wont hurt it, you just leave it alone and reduce it. There are also low and hightemperature glues, with the hightemperature version producing a stronger bond. I have been working with wood and wood glue most of my life. Im no expert on hot hide blue, but i have made it up a number of times from pearl and had no problem with irregular mixing or foaming.
The last step was to coat the wrapped joint with a bit of hot hide glue. By simply using hot hide glue, you can apply glue to a block of wood, known as a glue. Book depository books with free delivery worldwide. Hide glue, on the other hand, achieves its results by molecular bonding. I made a pot for the glue by using a small crock with a plexi lid that has a hole for suspending a smsll 8oz mason jar.
I do use a candy thermometer to gage the temp, but i always use a doubleboiler approach. Hello everybody, i have a question for hide glue users. Use coldpress adhesive with cauls or a vacuum bag, or use hot hide glue with a. As with any adhesive, titebond liquid hide glue must stand the test of time and that may take a few more years hide glue has been around for millennia. There should be no need to clean the brush after every use if you are using hot hide glue. This might be due to expansion rates, cooling rates, oil, or something else entirely. Copper distributes heat well and may well impart a resistance to mold and fungus. This will increase the risk of injury and may damage your project. Dualtemperature hot glue guns are available, which allow you to switch temperatures for either glue stick type. The liquid hide glue works well though i never tried it. Recently joshua klein published a supersimple recipe for making your own liquid hide glue from glue granules, tap water and canning salt. That said, liquid hide glue has a lot of urea in it to keep it liquefied. You can make your own quite easily and its also very inexpensive compared to the commercial product.
The hot glue sounds a bit to difficult for me to work with so i was thinking the titebond hide glue in the bottle or the titebond original glue. In it, i will try to answer for you all of the questions you may have about hot animal hide glue from questions i. Kind of like a mold, or something i can remove it off of after the glue has dried. Not to go over board, but where has this stuff been all my life. It forms strong joints, but allows joint disassembly with a hot knife. A typical steelstring guitar has 150 to 170 pounds of tension on the strings 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, for decades. Shelf life is 1218 months if stored in a cool, dry location.
The subject of this article floated through my mind one day as i. Cleans up easily with a stick of wood and sands better than that rubbery stuff. Hot hide glue questions and answers written by craig brougher. Glue sticks are available in a variety of colors, even glitterfilled and glowinthedark. Fresh hide glue also bonds to itself, making repairs on vintage instruments much easier, no more hours spent scraping and removing stubborn old glue. When all is ready i remove the jar from the hot waterpot, the glue stays useable for several minutes, long enough to get the seams together etc. There are numerous indications that a copper pot is ideal for hot hide glue.
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